Speed Mods

[randompop101]

Hi, everyone I'm new in the forum, but I'm not new in DDR because I started playing since the 1st mix. It's been 10 years lol. I'm from Taiwan.
Ever since I started playing, I've never got around to modifying the songs in anyway while I played. That's how I play, no speed mods and no bars.
My level, hmm., is able to clear all 8-footers with a decent score on the first try,including some low to mid-end 9-footers on the first try.
Not until very recently did I find out the sheer number of people using speed mods. I'm just thinking, even for songs with complicated arrow patterns, it would be more beneficial for players to learn how to read arrows than to purposely space them out. I can understand people holding on to the bar due to the various physical conditions of different people, but if people aren't able to do well on all songs consistently without speed mods, they're probably not up to the level yet. What do you guys think?

[IXAM]

Speed mods were a must for most of those that switched over to ITG after Extreme, and they've stuck with most players since.
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My Recall: Random Challenges Are Welcome

[stuffmonger]

I don't use speed modifiers or the bar either. But, I just started playing in may, and am only about a 7foot level so far.

[melink14]

If you consider 1x to be like .25 or .5 in ITG then the conversion starts to make sense.

Although, there are many speed mod players who can't play 1x, the truly good people might get slightly worse scores on 1x but are still pretty damn good.

[yukihime]

Speaking as one of the *ahem* older generation (and I don't mean of DDR players ) and as someone with meniere's disease (which DDR is actually helping the balance part a little bit with!) ...

I started playing in May and I'm now starting to "dabble" (i.e. training mode 90%, game mode 10%) on Standard. Up to this point no, I'd not used the mod. First because I didn't know what it was and once I did, I was like, you're on basic - you better not need a mod yet. Well, that was before I encountered songs like Arrabiatta, Bag, Paranoia Kcet - the crazy songs! And I still resisted until I was given the wise advice by more than a few people here to use the mod, don't try toughing it out and get completely flummoxed. Guess what, it does help!

Without that 1.5x speed mod for the 8th and 16th notes I'd be in BIG trouble. Some of these songs, at least for me, I'd never get at first. It just looks like a huge jumble of multicolored arrows flying up the screen.

By using the mod you give yourself a small help with it spacing the arrows out so you CAN see that tricky little jump or triplet stuck in the middle of a 200 bpm song.

Personally, I see no difference between using the mod and using a chair, the bar, whatever to hold onto as a help to play a song.
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Live Like There's No Tomorrow,
Dance Like Nobody's Watching!

[rddr]

[randompop101]

Hi, I'm very happy that this forum is pretty active. The reason I joined this forum was because I thought DDR was dying, at least in Taiwan. It pains me that ddr is dying because I'm a veteran of the game. Right now I'm in Canada and I can hardly find any arcade with a machine. Well, I guess I want to feel like I belong to some group.
OK, back to the topic, the reason why I think it's beneficial to not use speed mods is because it will train you better in reading arrows, especially fast songs with intermediate gallops in between fast jumps, or medium paced songs with packed arrows. I fully understand many players might feel discouraged or frustrated at some songs, and you might even progress slower than others without speed mods, but ONCE YOU PROGRESS, you're well ahead of the game. I'm in the maniac DDR scene for so long that somebody clearing 10-footers doesn't impress me because people can just play it over and over again. Some people read stepcharts online, some people speed it up, after all these old songs are played to death, then they come to the arcade to show off? I would rather see promising players making "allround" progress in all areas of the game. If Konami were to give you a new song, without ever playing it and without using speed mods, would you be able to clear the song knowing you have no problems with any area of the game? If people get used to speed mods, then they are missing out on an important skill in improvement.

[maxx freak]

I agree completely with randompop. I feel like speedmods should be training wheels, in a way. Condensed arrows such as in bag and other songs are supposed to add to the challenge, not be canceled out by speed mods during normal play. You can ask me to do any song on 1x and I'll do it. Heck, I'd do bloodrush on 1x if I could do 12s.

But that's one thing I really don't like about ITG. ITG was designed for people who constantly use speed mods and the bar, ALL THE TIME, and the charts reflect that. DDR compromises and accommodates those on any level of play, any ability level.

[melink14]

The problem is you assume there's some situation where a person wouldn't be able to use speed mods. But this assumption isn't really backed up by anything.

Of course, there are lots of instances where it could be useful. 1x or forced mods tournaments for one, especially if they were sight read tournaments. Oni rankings of course.

Interest in stuff like that is pretty much dead though.

As a 1x player I think it's misleading to think there's some sort of grandiose benefit to playing 1x. It's just something I do to add a bit of edge to my game. (Actually, I'm just too lazy to go to the options menu.)

[rddr]

[Xanthros]

There's no reason to become good at being able to read 1x if you can use speed mods on every song (which you can). Unless you like 1x or plan on entering 1x tournaments, there is no benefit.

Also, I dunno about every top DDR player, but I'm pretty sure all the best ITG players (which includes some of the best DDR players) are not nearly as good on 1x as with speed mods, and do not care.

Speed mods do not disqualify your score, and they were put in the game by the developers, so if it's easier for you to use them, then doing that seems like the best strategy to me.

I started playing DDR 5th mix and played as a 1x no bar player for several years. I progressed over a number of years to the point where I could pass almost every 11 in ITG (and every song in Extreme except PSMO). Once I started using more speed mods and the bar, I increased in skill incredibly fast, both 1x no bar, and mods w/bar.

I really don't think playing 1x helps you much, especially not when you're just starting. You should work your way up as you feel the need to, and play at whatever speed is comfortable. If I had done this I would have been as good as I am now a couple years ago.

I do still think 1x (no bar) is fun sometimes, and I am definitely happy that I am pretty good at it, but I really don't think it's crucial. Also I would never play anything on ITG 1x...lol.

[randompop101]

Hi, everyone, I'll wrap it up. I understand that, as a traditional no-mod player, I might as well be speaking a foreign language to this forum's members as most here are used to speed mods. That's fine. The option to modify arrow speeds were not the original design, it was later added to the game in 2nd mix. Yes, I'm from the arcade background originally. When I was back in Taiwan, most good players there didn't use it. Yes, you could always use the speed mod, but bear in mind the stepcharts were created to match a song's difficulty level. They intend you to try the song the way it was designed. The packed arrows in some songs were designed as an added challenge to justify the song's foot difficulty rating.
I truly believe DDR is a skill, and an art. It would be meaningless to forfeit this skill and just try to memorize steps. But I understand this kind of advice is hard for many of you to digest. I'll say this last time in this thread. I'm happy there are still a couple of players who appreciate this "traditional" skill. For those of you who still care, I do hope that one day you can go to the arcade, feeling totally confident , put the selection on random, let your second nature( the skill you've mastered) take care of the stepping, and just enjoy the song. I call that real DDR. Goodnight everyone.

[Slowpoke]

[randompop101]

Oh my... I was actually going to bed soon but I just have to say this..

Slowpoke, what I mean is our differences in conceptualizing the benefits of not using speed-mods. Some people( I know, not you) might not fully grasp my point of view. I'm not saying that you don't understand my language or something.
I feel very sorry that I've offended you. I apologize here and hope the rest of the readers don't take it the wrong way.

This time I've got to go to bed. Goodnight

[pleasedon'thurtme]

[ʎɐb sı ʞ01ɹǝɥs]

[pleasedon'thurtme]

Hey, it is always good to hear people's opinions, so don't be so quick to dismiss such discussions as "pointless" -- you never know what new tidbit of information you might learn I tried Bag on I believe triple speed using the Playstation controller -- it was ridiculous how much easier it was than what I expected I would expect anything greater than one and a half speed to be tougher for most songs because that would make them blazing fast -- the average song tends to be in the lower 100's, so doubling that would make it close 300 beats per minute -- and if that turns to be not so bad (doubling a 130 beats per minute song might not be too terribly insane), the faster speed modifiers would be sure to blow the speed to outrageous levels. Of course, I do not know if the spread in steps would make it easier to read to the point it cancels out the blazing speed as Bag on triple speed is the only occasion I remember using a speed modifier. And I believe I shall use that as my counterargument to the last post that suggests relying on speed modifiers does not indicate less skill -- Bag was so easy on triple speed, but I cannot pass it on normal speed expert (yes, I forgot to mention this was expert on which I tried it with the modifier) because I can't read steps scrunched so closely together. Speed is a factor in the difficulty; therefore, altering the speed of the steps will most certainly alter the difficulty -- and different difficulties summon different skill levels. It is like box-squat or towel bench-press -- the lesser distance to move one's arms or legs allows one to lift more weight.
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[randompop101]

[ʎɐb sı ʞ01ɹǝɥs]

[ʎɐb sı ʞ01ɹǝɥs]

MODS PLEASE LOCK THIS TOPIC.

OP WAS JUST TRYING TO ASK A SIMPLE QUESTION. CAN'T WE HAVE A NICE DISCUSSION WITHOUT SOME ELITISTS TURNING IT INTO A FLAME WAR?

OH AND PLEASE GIVE ME WARNING POINTS BECAUSE I AM A VERY MEAN MAN WHO BELITTLES OTHERS BECAUSE HE'S GOODER THAN THEM AT DDR.



Better yet, just make an announcement that speed mod debates are banned. Sure did the trick for bar/no-bar discussion...