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JustJeff
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Joined: 16 Jan 2002
Location: Around here somewhere. |
0.  Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 3:13 pm Post subject: Watch IGN.com's In The Groove Producer Interview |
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| PS2.IGN.com has posted an interview with In The Groove producer John Tam. Watch it and learn more about the features of this game and how it differs from DDR and PIU. |
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'Ivan
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Joined: 01 Aug 2004
Location: Thailand |
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Uiru
Contributor
Joined: 25 Sep 2003
Location: the floating castle of Newfoundland |
| 2. Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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I went, tried to view it, it won't let me.
Requesting someone post his explanation about how ITG differs from DDR so that I can laugh heartily. Really, I want to hear it.
~Uiru
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Light_373
Trick Member
Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Location: Chicago |
| 3. Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 5:42 pm Post subject: |
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| The interview was cool, makes me want to play itg more. But then again, the closest arcade to me that has that is 20 miles away and i don't have a ps2. |
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Travissssssssss
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Joined: 09 Apr 2005
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| 4. Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 5:58 pm Post subject: |
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| Light_373 wrote: | | The interview was cool, makes me want to play itg more. But then again, the closest arcade to me that has that is 20 miles away and i don't have a ps2. |
Haha, twenty miles isn't that far. Other people (like me) drive a lot further than that. |
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PKMN.YnoT
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Joined: 28 Jan 2005
Location: Richmond, B.C. Canada |
| 5. Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, 20 miles is like less than an hour's driving (well, we use Metric System in Canada, but I think that's about right?). My closest ITG machine's about an hour from where I live too, and I still play quite a lot (mainly because that arcade is inside the university that I go to for school though).
EDIT: After thinking about what I just posted, for some reason I decided to figure out the exact #s. 20mi= 32.18688km. That's more like a bit more than half an hour.
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Last edited by PKMN.YnoT on Thu Apr 21, 2005 6:28 pm, edited 1 time in total |
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Light_373
Trick Member
Joined: 11 Apr 2005
Location: Chicago |
| 6. Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 6:20 pm Post subject: |
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| I don't have a car. Thanks for the advice though. |
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Arctic Wolves
Trick Member
Joined: 16 Dec 2004
Location: Canada |
| 7. Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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That video was a good opportunity to watch the background movies. No seriously, I like watching them, ITG has some gooders.
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sherl0k
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Joined: 27 Jan 2002
Location: the internet |
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Rancidfish
Trick Member
Joined: 29 Jun 2002
Location: Santa Rosa, CA/Santa Cruz, CA |
| 9. Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 11:53 pm Post subject: |
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| ITG is better wrote: | | Light_373 wrote: | | The interview was cool, makes me want to play itg more. But then again, the closest arcade to me that has that is 20 miles away and i don't have a ps2. |
Haha, twenty miles isn't that far. Other people (like me) drive a lot further than that. |
For a while, I'd go ~90 miles to play ItG about once every other week. Roadtripping is a lot of fun if you have friends with you. Nowadays, there's an ItG machine only about 20-30 miles away, so I go a lot more often.
...
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Drastick
Roxor Staff
Joined: 06 Feb 2002
Location: Oregon |
| 10. Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 12:16 am Post subject: |
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| 'Ivan wrote: | | . . . what we need is an interview on the making of In The Groove. Is there one of those out there? Anyone? |
Hummm so you want a making of ITG deal??
I dunno how exciting that would be watching us work.... My average day is just talking with Kyle, calling each other names, working, more name calling and insulting, more working, so on. It is quite enjoyable :) No one really asks, what kinda stuff do people want to know? |
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Rancidfish
Trick Member
Joined: 29 Jun 2002
Location: Santa Rosa, CA/Santa Cruz, CA |
| 11. Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 12:35 am Post subject: |
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Like, I dunno... what exactly went into the ItG engine to make it different from the Stepmania engine? Everyone's heard "it's only based on the Stepmania engine, it's not Stepmania!" but a lot of people are still doubtful. Getting a solid description in words of "here's what we changed" would probably be a big help.
Also, I'd love to see a documentary about Foy designing an expert chart, involving videos of him wearing headphones looking pensive, videos of him playing the song, and videos of him looking (as usual) like he's about to kill someone. (In all seriousness, seeing a video of the changes a stepchart like Bend Your Mind or Utopia expert goes through during development would be awesome.)
And then of course... something about the 3D design going into the arrows and the backgrounds. 
There are a lot of subjects you could cover, and we'd love to see them covered.
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Drastick
Roxor Staff
Joined: 06 Feb 2002
Location: Oregon |
| 12. Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 12:50 am Post subject: |
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| Ya I don't blame him for "Looking like he is going to kill someone" Hours and hours of listening to the same song :lol: I think the coolest part about working on steps is that even after listening and working with the same song for so long that they are so enjoyable at the end and you still love playing it. It is always a good sign when you are getting distracted by your own work. As for backgrounds and stuff, when I am working on the backgrounds I play the song that I am working on in the backgrounds so that it inspires the mood of which the artwork is to create for that song. |
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Sinistar
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Joined: 20 Nov 2003
Location: State College, PA, US |
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Boochypa
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Joined: 26 Nov 2003
Location: VA Tech |
| 14. Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 9:07 am Post subject: |
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| Sinistar wrote: | | He also mentioned that ITG is good for beginners because it has a Novice mode, failing to mention that DDR is good for beginners because it has a, well, Beginner mode (depending on mix, of course). |
Except DDR's beginner mode isn't good for beginners.
The characters in the background not only suggest staying in the middle the whole time, but they also illustrate "reserving" certain arrows for certain feet; I think they only use their right foot to hit up and only their left foot to hit down (obviously it doesn't matter in such pointlessly easy songs), which is definitely not a good habit to get into. |
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Sinistar
Trick Member
Joined: 20 Nov 2003
Location: State College, PA, US |
| 15. Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 9:22 am Post subject: |
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| Boochypa wrote: | Except DDR's beginner mode isn't good for beginners.
The characters in the background not only suggest staying in the middle the whole time, but they also illustrate "reserving" certain arrows for certain feet; I think they only use their right foot to hit up and only their left foot to hit down (obviously it doesn't matter in such pointlessly easy songs), which is definitely not a good habit to get into. |
It is, however, how beginner players actually play DDR, even without the avatar. When I started, I had only myself to learn from, and I used that very same method (I started with Ultramix 1, which doesn't have Beginner). It wasn't until I did gameplay research here that I learned I would do better if I stayed out of the middle altogether. If you start somebody off on Light who has never played before, they'll hug the center until you force them to do otherwise. The Lesson mode in DDR, however, does teach about foot placement outside of the center. But it didn't sound like ITG's Novice mode was anything akin to DDR's Lesson mode.
Tam's point (as I understood it) in the video wasn't anything to do with training or guidance, it was to do with the ease of step charts for the Novice mode. That same argument applies to DDR's Beginner mode, which makes the differentiation between ITG and DDR in that regard fairly pointless. He had to mention it, though, to offset the fact that he pointed out ITG's appeal to advanced/hardcore players. Mentioning Novice mode was a way to say, "Don't let ITG scare you."
What I also found funny was the mention of difficulty ratings, that "other games" only go to 10, but that ITG goes higher. I had myself a nice little Spinal Tap flashback at that point.  It was a valid point, no doubt - increasing the scale allows you to maintain the difficulty expectations of people coming to ITG from "other games", but I chuckled at it nonetheless.
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Reenee
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Joined: 21 Nov 2003
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| 16. Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 10:40 am Post subject: |
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| Does anybody know when IGN realizes they should just dump the stupid restriction on QuickTime because it's a better (AND OVERALL STABLE) player anyways? |
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cfusionpm
Trick Member
Joined: 24 Jan 2002
Location: San Diego, CA |
| 17. Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 11:28 am Post subject: |
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i like how, in the interview, he says how this game changes and expands on current dance games because of the increased difficulty and modifiers, which, in reality, is nothing more than what stepmania had (and has done still) for years. the only thing remotely new about the game are the hands (which i personally think are moronic) and mines (which i personally think are cool). although, now that i think of it, sm had "hands" too. there are at least a handful old simfiles for sm that had 3 and 4 arrows at once, AND ddr 1st and 2nd mix edit modes allowed for up to 4 arrows at once. anyway, both of those features got maybe one sentence, while everything else (minus novice mode) could be dubbed over to describe stepmania at any time over the past few years. i know its nothing new to say, but all itg is, is an arcade (and now ps2) port of stepmania with mines. i also chuckled to myself when he mentioned how "its an easier game to pick up because of how the stepcharts ... are synced with the music." 
edit: its especially hillarious when you can download and play essentially the same game for free (stepmania) and have a nearly infinate library with endless customization. but hell, im buying it, so there goes that point. 
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Reenee
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Joined: 21 Nov 2003
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| 18. Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 11:38 am Post subject: |
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| I think when he meant it's synced with the music, it's REALLY CLOSELY synced to the music. |
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Uiru
Contributor
Joined: 25 Sep 2003
Location: the floating castle of Newfoundland |
| 19. Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 11:38 am Post subject: |
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| Sinistar wrote: | | What I also found funny was the mention of difficulty ratings, that "other games" only go to 10, but that ITG goes higher. I had myself a nice little Spinal Tap flashback at that point. :) |
Yeah, that is pretty humorous. :D
DDR's scale 'only' going to 11 is simply an error with the step conventions used by Konami. Consider stuff like bag, Sakura, Mad Blast and Outer Limits. This stuff is clearly harder than most 9s (most) but Max 300 and PARANOiA Survivor eat the four of them alive. Just the other night I did Outer Limits on Final Stage (on a four-song set) without breaking a sweat, yet Max 300 continues to be hit and miss even on 1st Stage (usually miss).
The reason why I think we haven't gotten past 10+ is because back in the day, a 10 was a 10, an obvious jump high above anything ever encountered in DDR. This meant something, and it's a notion Konami is clinging to, despite facts that say otherwise. In reality, I would say we are at least at 13 as well. You've got your general 10s, where 10 is no more impressive a number than 7 or 4, like Sakura and Outer Limits and (let's think progressively) Cartoon Heroes and Healing Vision Angelic Mix. On top of that is nutshit like Max 300 and The Legend of Max, good solid 11s. At 12 is MaxX Unlimited, PARANOiA Survivor MAX, and such, with PSMo and Max. (period) reigning supreme at 13. We are at the point where flashing 10 is supposed to simply mean "dickheadedly hard", and measuring dickheadedness relative to itself was not Konami's goal (see the Another difficulties in Beatmania IIDX for examples of this). However, IIDX's Anothers are getting real difficulties now, and I expect we'll soon see the same with DDR. However, I wouldn't expect a blown-up DDR sim to understand such subtlety.
I do not claim that ITG does not have harder songs than DDR does at this time, because I haven't played them. Mines and hands, while stupid constructs on a machine not equipped to handle them, artificially increase difficulty as well. I am not altogether convinced, however, that anyone who can pass PSMo regularly, or who could pass Max. (period) without learning or memorizing the speedup, would find any *real* challenge, certainly with mines and hands turned off. (I nearly failed Justify My Love the other day simply because I had never played it before, and the next time I FC'd it. And that's what, an 8?)
More of the funny-
If it weren't for American music, our US DDR mixes wouldn't have been ruined the way they were. If ITG wants to ignore the rest of the world, they're welcome to, but that's their problem. And if Konami wanted to give us retarded mod after retarded mod, they are certainly more than capable of doing so. I'm not going to jump up and down if the next DDR mix lets me set arrows to wiggle back and forth, or spin.
Maybe one day Roxor will figure out that making someone else's idea look flashy does not make it your idea.
~Uiru
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